An Interview with the Spirit of Li Daoyu, Former Chinese Ambassador to the United States
Recorded by 法寧
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Interview with Xi Zhongxun (Former Vice Premier of the State Council of China, Father of Chinese President Xi Jinping)
Record of Interviews with Deceased Modern Chinese Celebrities (Preface)
Interview with Peng Shilu (Pioneer and Founder of China's Nuclear Power Industry)
Unlocking the Mysteries of the Human Body
Daily Discourse: Each Originally Like an Eminent Monk, Wandering Through Many Lives Stained by Emotion
Daily Discourse: Diligent practice reveals the innate selflessness; through no-self, the Buddha's path is attained
A Century of Wandering: The Spirit of Toowoomba
Making Good Use of Buddha's Power
Date recorded 31 May 2026
This is a record of an interview with Li Daoyu, who sought at the Hsiang Kuang Buddhist Centre in Australia. He now resides in the Western Land of Nature. This account reflects upon his life as a diplomat and his subsequent journey through the hells. Recorded by the chief writer, Fa Ning, on May 31, 2026.
Li Daoyu speaks:
". I have arrived in this world of shimmering golden light, and I have been here for several days now. I am working hard to familiarise myself with and understand all the Dharma that the Buddha has spoken. In this Buddha-land, I can hear the Dharma sounds of Namo Amituofo and Practitioner Su at every moment. It is truly magnificent!
Every word the Buddha speaks flows naturally into my heart, and my heart is filled with Dharma ! It allows me to see clearly what this world before me is truly about. I am so, so happy now—so incredibly joyful! I am finally free from suffering!
I once fell into hell after I passed away. Although my time in hell was only a little over a month—which is short compared to the experiences of many others—it was enough for me to realise that it is a world of unbearable suffering. Every single second in hell, my entire spiritual body endured immense agony. It was truly a case of calling to the heavens with no response, and calling to the earth with no answer. No matter how hard I tried to escape that predicament, there was no way out; I was trapped in an endless cycle of suffering.
Before the laws of and cause and effect, status and position mean absolutely nothing. A human life is merely temporary, a complete illusion. Before the Universal Principle, the Truth, and the Right Way, there is no high or low, no you or me. There is no exemption from the suffering of hell just because one held a high position. On the contrary, those with higher status often create even more severe negative karma, and their experience in hell is truly too horrific to witness!
Here, space is wide open. I can basically see whatever I wish to see, and I see it very clearly. Practitioner Su once mentioned that she has saved beings throughout five thousand years of Chinese history. After seeing this for myself, I was truly shocked. It turns out that so many emperors, generals, and people from all walks of life cannot avoid the suffering of hell after death. Especially the monarchs of each generation—one could say that almost every emperor could not avoid the path to hell after death. They were so glorious while alive, yet every one of them had to go to hell to suffer after they died. And I, a mere diplomat of China—though it seemed like a position of supreme status—was also unable to escape suffering!
The hell I fell into was the Tongue-Plucking Hell, or Tongue-Excavation Hell. It means my tongue was extracted in the most brutal way possible. I bled so much that I would faint from the pain. Yet, I would quickly come back to life, and my body would be restored. Then, my tongue would be pulled out again, and I would faint from the pain once more. It was a pain that tore through my heart and lungs.
King Yama did not tell me much about why I fell into hell. He only said that everything I had done in the past was not the Right Way, and that much of what I said was not the Right Way, so I had to go to the Tongue-Plucking Hell to receive my retribution. I could not understand it at all. Was everything I said not for the good of the country? How could it not be the Right Way?
In my view, as long as I was doing things for the country, it was a good deed. It was the responsibility of us diplomats to secure more benefits for the country and raise its international status. Especially in the last century, China often could not hold its head high before many countries in the world, often looked down upon by powerful nations like the United States. It was not like today, where we have a huge voice before all nations. It was not like that before. So, we diplomats and various other people had to rely on making all sorts of arrangements abroad for the country. All this work required the use of this tongue. This was my professional duty, so I did not think it was a source of creating negative karma. Without this tongue, I could not get things done.
But looking back now, it must be that when I was doing this work, the words I spoke violated the Universal Principle, the Truth, and the Right Way taught in the Buddha’s teachings, which is why I ended up with such an outcome. This is all very natural; I cannot blame anyone. Are we diplomats not using this tongue as our most important tool of transmission? Without this tongue, without this mouth, I would have no way to convey what our country wanted to express to the other party.
I once served as the Chinese Ambassador to the United States, which was a very important and sacred job. At that time, our work meant that a part of the relationship between China and the United States, as well as various arrangements regarding international status, situations, and interests, were all handled by us on the front lines, negotiating with the other side. Not to mention that the Americans were no ordinary people—they were all extremely clever—and we had to understand their language, background, culture, and other knowledge as Chinese people to be able to express things in a way they could best understand.
So, in this work, I racked my brains, constantly thinking about how to respond, how to say the most beautiful words to make the other party feel satisfied, and to make them respect a dignified China, to give us reasonable benefits, or to give us more consideration in various arrangements. This was my job, so I was always thinking, constantly watching the international situation to change the direction of my speech. Sometimes, to cater to different groups of people, I had to say different things to gain everyone's approval. I also had to build good relationships with many officials, big and small, in private, so that things could go smoothly when it came time to act.
Being a diplomat is truly not easy! I thought very carefully and meticulously. I knew that saying the wrong word would come at a great cost, so I always walked with caution, as if walking on thin ice."
The Buddha always says that everyone simply lacks the proper education. In the eyes of the Buddha, there are no distinctions in all of this. It is just that in the process of experiencing the laws of karma and cause and effect, as well as the six realms of rebirth, everyone encounters different opportunities and life circumstances, which is why the manifestations appear so different. Education can help everyone grow and achieve spiritual sublimation.
Therefore, it is no exaggeration to say that Namo Amituofo is the greatest educator in the entire universe; this is truly the case. An educator’s heart is equal, selfless, without self, without thought, and without attachment. This allows all beings to truly understand what the Buddha wishes to express—it is all so straightforward, so sincere, without the slightest bit of concealment.
This is so different from the world I once knew. In the past, everything I did required careful consideration and meticulous planning. Every single action was contrary to the Universal Principle, the Truth, and the Right Way, yet I was completely unaware of it. I thought this was just the established tradition that had to be continued to ensure that the country presented its best face to the international community.
We, the so-called patriots, might have sounded like patriots, but we did not realise that by presenting a facade that was not entirely authentic, everything we did was actually the exact opposite of the truth. Anyone with a discerning eye could see that this was very damaging to the country's image. Even if others could not see it, by acting in such a way, we were creating even greater negative karma. We carried a strong sense of concealment, all to protect our own interests.
Thus, before understanding Buddhist education, one often creates karma without even knowing it. The higher one's status, the easier it is to fall into such a predicament, creating immeasurable and boundless karma while remaining completely oblivious. They cannot listen to the advice of those around them, believing that everything they say is correct. The stronger one's subjectivity, the greater the karma created—that is simply how it is.
As a diplomat, I, Li Daoyu, exhausted all my efforts to maintain the relationship between China and the United States. Future generations have praised me highly, and the country has awarded me many prizes and medals in recognition. However, those who read this interview must see clearly: what I want to express is that no matter what you do, you must take the Universal Principle, the Truth, and the Right Way as your standard. If you cannot act according to the Buddha’s teachings, you will create negative karma and become a very poor example. I hope everyone will take my story as a mirror. Looking back now, my entry into the tongue-pulling hell was not unjust at all; everything was summoned by my own karma.
The Buddha’s teachings do not say that the retribution we suffer is due to punishment from some deity. Everything is a natural occurrence within nature; what one does naturally attracts the corresponding retribution, whether good or bad. It is not like other religions where a deity decides our life, death, good, evil, or our future destination. It is not like that at all. Everything is happening so naturally.
I also urge my fellow Chinese citizens to open your eyes and see this truth clearly. If there are those who are still creating negative karma, you must stop immediately, or you will be the ones to suffer. Do not take this lightly. Because when we are not in control of ourselves, the karma we create—piece by piece, item by item—might seem like nothing, but if you truly dissect it, you would be shocked yourself.
I am now speaking to everyone in a relatively calm tone, without the emotional fluctuations and I had before. This is the power brought to me by the purification of the Western Land of Dharma Nature. Here, I am constantly filled with energy and the power of Goodness, because the Buddha-light can purify all negative energy and feelings into nothingness, allowing me to feel peace of mind under the baptism of the Buddha-light time and time again.
This Western Land of Dharma Nature, which comes from Practitioner Su of the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre in Australia, is truly real. Moreover, after he realised his true nature and attained Buddhahood in the human world, he followed Namo Amituofo, step by step, to establish this spiritual world, allowing all beings in the spiritual realms to have a place to go. Before we are reborn in the Western Land of Ultimate Bliss, there is a transit station that gives us a place to stay. This is the meaning of the of Buddhas and Bodhisattvas—when people seek, they respond. Practitioner Su is truly too great. He is always thinking of beings, always delivering sentient beings. He does not live for himself, but only for the sake of beings. He thinks only of how to help us beings escape suffering and achieve spiritual growth. He is also always hoping and longing for a successor to inherit his skills, to attain Buddhahood, and to save countless suffering beings. Everyone must work hard on this!
I am now in the status of a spirit; I have no opportunity to do anything, nor am I qualified to say much. However, the fourfold assembly of disciples at the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre, you are the ones closest to the Buddha, and you still have bodies with which to practice. You must diligently follow in the footsteps of Practitioner Su. Whether this world becomes good or bad in the future depends on you. I sincerely hope that more corporations will recognise the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre so that the temple can obtain sufficient resources to expand, and only then will it be able to welcome more children to learn the true Buddhist education here and inherit the skills of Practitioner Su. The same goes for influential figures; once you recognise this place, you can promote it vigorously so that more people can know about the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre.
I am very grateful for the compassion of the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas, and I am filled with admiration and joy.
Gratitude to the compassion of Namo Amituofo and Practitioner Su!
Namo Amituofo.
Li Daoyu
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