This is a record of an interview with Zhu Yuanzhang, the founding emperor of the Ming Dynasty, who sought at the Hsiang Kuang Buddhist Centre in Australia. Having endured the profound suffering of the hells, he now resides in the . This testimony was recorded by the chief writer, Fa Ning, on March 7, 2026.
Zhu Yuanzhang speaks:
". I am Zhu Yuanzhang, the founding emperor of the Ming Dynasty, a name known to every Chinese person. I do not possess great literary talent, nor am I skilled in composing poetry. I simply served as an emperor with diligence for several decades—a relatively long reign for that era. Future generations have offered both praise and criticism, which is only natural. Looking back now, having understood the Buddha’s teachings brought to us by Namo Amituofo, I realise that both before and after ascending the throne, I created much . I achieved great merits, but I also committed grave errors. This is the life story of most emperors, and it is certainly mine.
A Humble Beginning and the Path to the Throne
I am still that same Zhu Yuanzhang, the first emperor of the Ming Dynasty, known as the Hongwu Emperor. That name carries such authority, perfectly matching the style of my rule over those decades. Once, I was a complete nobody, a peasant whom no one knew. In the final years of the Yuan Dynasty, people lived in extreme poverty. The government was utterly corrupt; everyone was reduced to eating grass roots, and even wild yams were dug up until none remained. At that time, I was so thin I was practically skin and bones. I was not short, but I was gaunt. Having lost my parents at a young age, I was truly a child from a tragic story.
During my darkest and hungriest moments, I went to a temple and begged the abbot to let me become a monk. I did not understand the Buddha’s teachings then, but I had heard a few famous lines. The abbot asked me, 'Child, why do you wish to become a monk?' I replied, 'Because I have nothing left. Doesn't the say, "Originally there is not a single thing; where could dust settle?" That describes me perfectly! Since I have nothing, isn't becoming a monk a wonderful thing?' The abbot was very compassionate and said, 'You are right. Empty and void—if you can become a monk and perhaps attain Buddhahood, that would be best.' I did not think twice; I agreed immediately, thinking I would worry about Buddhahood after I had a full meal.
The Rise of a Leader
I did not stay a monk for long, as the temple eventually ran out of food. I was starving, and as others left to forage, I decided I did not want to spend my life wasting away in a temple. I was young, strong, and full of spirit. I wandered like a beggar, eating wild vegetables and drinking river water just to survive. Eventually, I joined the peasant uprisings against the corrupt Yuan government. I did not have grand ambitions at first; I just wanted a stable life. Because of my courage and decent martial skills, I was quickly promoted by the rebel leader Guo Zixing, eventually becoming his right-hand man.
I fought bravely, eliminating many of his troublesome enemies. However, I had my own ambitions. I secretly cultivated my own loyal followers, and when Guo Zixing passed away, I naturally inherited the leadership of the anti-Yuan forces. Later, I ascended the throne in Nanjing, marking the official beginning of the Ming Dynasty. I expanded north and soon captured the Yuan capital in Beijing. From south to north, China became my domain. My life was legendary, and this experience gave me a profound understanding of the suffering of the common people. For the first thirty years of my life, I witnessed every kind of hardship. Consequently, I chose to be a diligent and frugal emperor. I believed I was a good ruler; I did not indulge in excess, and I kept my harem small. I worked tirelessly to govern the state.
The Burden of Personality and Power
However, my character was not good. Of course, few emperors in history have had good characters. I say this because, in these past few days in the Western Dharma-Nature Land, listening to Practitioner Su explain the Dharma, I have reflected on my time as emperor. From the perspective of the Buddha’s gate, I was committing transgressions every single day. My greatest flaws were my temper, my arrogance, and my suspicion. In my later years, these traits made me increasingly cruel and paranoid. Many of the founding ministers who had contributed so much to my dynasty were executed, along with their entire families.
Looking back at such cruel actions, I am filled with shame! Each of those ministers had made indelible contributions to the Ming Dynasty. But my arrogance and my greed for power made me fear that others would seize my throne. I was easily swayed by the malicious words of sycophants. I often could not listen to 'loyal words that grate on the ear.' Especially in my old age, I preferred praise. When I was nearing the end of my life and losing control, I would happily accept any flattery, but if anyone offered even the slightest criticism or suggested a policy correction, I would fly into a rage and punish them without mercy.
The Consequences of Karma
Most of my reign was clear-headed. I established laws and rules to help the people recover from the devastation of war. I reduced taxes, helped people rebuild their homes, and encouraged the cultivation of wasteland. I valued education. I knew that a founding emperor had to pour his heart and soul into ensuring the continuity of the dynasty. I worked tirelessly to stabilise the chaos. But my life was defeated by my own character. My later years of sorrow and inability to govern myself were entirely the result of the character I had cultivated from youth to old age.
After I passed away, where did I go? The answer is clear: I went straight to the hells. The killing karma, the verbal karma, and the unwholesome thoughts I accumulated were far too many. From the merciless killing on the battlefield to the execution of my ministers, these acts could not be offset by the good I did for the people. I spent several hundred years in various hells—the Hell of Amputation, the Hell of Brain-Opening, and the Hell of Fire Wheels. King Yama originally sentenced me to over a thousand years of suffering, but he reduced it by five hundred years because I had never harmed innocent civilians and always granted amnesty to the people in the cities I conquered, ensuring they were fed. I truly had a compassionate heart for the common people.
A New Beginning in the Western Dharma-Nature Land
After emerging from the hells, I was a wandering soul without a home. I saw that China no longer had an emperor, yet the people still suffered through wars—this time against foreign invaders. I witnessed the Nanjing Massacre and wept. They were unarmed civilians, yet they were slaughtered. I wondered what kind of karma the Chinese people had created to suffer such a fate. I was a nobody before I was emperor, and after my time in hell, I was a nobody again. I drifted across the vast land of China, often troubled by a lack of energy.
Then, while searching for energy, a brilliant light appeared above me. I was startled; I had never seen such light as a ghost. It illuminated everything around me, and I followed it into another world. This world is the Western Dharma-Nature Land, established by Namo Amituofo and Practitioner Su. Here, I have learned of these miraculous things. I feel a sense of security I have never known before. I am filled with gratitude. Seeing the Buddha, I realised I had always known of the Buddha but never understood what the Buddha was doing, which is why the Buddha seemed so distant. Now, having met the true Namo Amituofo and the awakened being, Practitioner Su, I find it all truly inconceivable!
A Call to the World
I have seen many people from the Ming, Qing, Song, Tang, and Han dynasties here. Everyone is dressed in white, sitting on lotus seats, looking nothing like they did before. I have finally awakened! Practitioner Su is radiating light on Chinese soil, and every day, countless beings enter the Western Dharma-Nature Land. This is so precious! China has seen so much war and bloodshed over the millennia. This light from the Buddha has truly saved countless Chinese people, as well as wandering spirits, and even the souls of every blade of grass, every tree, and every warhorse. They have all been delivered by Practitioner Su and have regained their dignified human forms.
I am overwhelmed by the sheer number of beings! I am in awe of the Buddha's vast mind-capacity. Hearing that the Western Dharma-Nature Land will never be full brought tears to my eyes. I never expected that I, Zhu Yuanzhang, would have the fortune to join the ranks of those saved by Practitioner Su. I want to shout to all the people of China: Namo Amituofo is truly at the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre in Australia. You must believe in the Buddha to be saved! Why reject the Buddha's teachings? No matter how high or great a person is, they cannot escape the cycle of birth, aging, sickness, and death. Who can escape the six realms of rebirth?
Without the Buddha, without Namo Amituofo and the of Practitioner Su, none of us in the Western Dharma-Nature Land could have escaped our suffering. We should be grateful! I, a dignified emperor, no longer wish to be an emperor. I have cast off my imperial robes, put on clean white clothes, and left behind my old temper and anger. Having suffered in the hells, how could I still be arrogant? I sit peacefully on my lotus seat, chanting the six-character name of Namo Amituofo, telling myself that I must continue this chanting until I reach the Western Land of Ultimate Bliss. This is the story of my life of several hundred years. Please, look closely and do not follow my old path!
Gratitude to the compassion of Namo Amituofo. Gratitude to the compassion of Practitioner Su.
Namo Amituofo.
Zhu Yuanzhang"
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