This is a record of an interview with the spirit of Venerable Master Chin Kung, who now resides in the . This account reflects upon his teachings regarding his disciples, specifically Venerable Wuzhuang. Recorded by the chief writer, Shi Haize, on November 8, 2022.
Venerable Master Chin Kung speaks:
". Today, I wish to continue our discussion from the previous two sessions. Namo Amituofo has set a topic for me: 'My Disciples.' Among these disciples, who should I speak of today?
A Different Kind of Dialogue
Reflecting on yesterday's discussion regarding Venerable Wudao—or 'Master Dao'—I must be honest: I have never before experienced such a long, uninterrupted period where I spoke and he remained silent, listening to my observations and suggestions. It is a very different experience. Usually, when disciples come to me to discuss matters or report on their progress, it is a back-and-forth exchange. They report, I offer a few words, they raise questions, and we discuss it. That is the standard way of communicating. So, to have a situation where I am speaking and they are unable to respond is quite a different feeling for me.
Why is this? Unless one is a Buddha or , who possesses perfect meditative concentration and the ability to observe the conditions of others—perceiving the past, present, and future simultaneously—it is difficult to provide a clear path. Even then, communication can only happen heart-to-heart; you receive only as much as your capacity allows. In truth, whenever we press our palms together to express our suffering or make a vow to the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas, they know our situation. They often provide a response on the spot; the question is whether you are capable of receiving it. This depends on three things: first, the degree of your own purification; second, your karmic affinity with the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas from past lives; and third, whether your own subjectivity is too strong. Are you merely speaking to vent, without the intention to listen? Or are you truly seeking a path? These mental states influence the heart-to-heart connection during your prayers.
The Necessity of Direct Speech
I bring this up because, as I spoke yesterday, I found the effect to be quite good. I did not have to overthink; I simply spoke directly. Often, if I speak directly to them in person, they have their own views, opinions, or justifications—which is only natural. In those moments, I often hold back my words. I watch to see how much they understand or take to heart. If you are sincerely seeking the and are willing to listen, I will say more. If you become emotional or let your ego take over, I say less, because I know you cannot absorb the teaching at that moment.
These are things we would normally say behind closed doors, but to save everyone, my spirit must speak clearly and plainly under these circumstances. This is what we call 'the Dharma has no fixed form.' I have come to understand one thing: in this age of the Dharma’s decline, before one has realised their true nature, one must act, speak, and teach according to the guidance of the ancestral masters and the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas. Just as I used to do when giving lectures, the method of 'repeating the teachings' is correct. Because if you have not realised your true nature, and you inject your own personal views into the lectures, you are mistaken. Every thought and intention of the beings in this world is nothing but , nothing but sin. This includes monastics, unless they have realised their true nature and have truly left the ranks of ordinary beings. Only then can they flow naturally with the Dharma, remain pure and at ease, and lecture without preparation, speaking eloquently on any sutra text that arises. Only those who have realised their true nature have this qualification.
The Burden of the Unawakened
Because the other party has gone through immense hardships and finally realised their true nature, they are one with the vastness of the Dharma Realm. They have no 'self,' and everything is clearly understood. That is why they are qualified to say they do not need preparation. But if one has not realised their true nature, are they qualified to say such things? Alas, to misinterpret a single word can lead to five hundred lifetimes as a wild fox. This is not a joke!
Therefore, monastics who lecture must still prepare as I used to do. This is my latest insight. However, for those who have realised their true nature, it is different. They can teach anytime, anywhere—every moment, every second, they are in a state of deep meditative concentration. In this state, they can teach wherever there is karmic affinity, because they possess the . This is why we hold the Buddhas, Bodhisattvas, and those who have realised their true nature in such high regard. Practitioner Su, or Su Fo, is like this. In the past, when I asked her to lecture—or rather, to share her experiences—she was always ready. She always brought something fresh to the audience, something that made people lean in and listen. People would come back again and again. She has that power of attraction, and even though she is a lay practitioner, it does not matter. In our societies, we often invite lay practitioners and volunteers with practical experience to speak if their insights can serve as a reference for others. This is necessary. I will be clear: the vast majority of my disciples today have not realised their true nature. You still have a great deal of room for effort on the Buddha’s path. You must be diligent!
A Message for Venerable Wuzhuang
Next, I would like to mention Venerable Wuzhuang. 'Zhuang' as in 'solemn and dignified.' Venerable Wuzhuang currently holds a key position at the Pure Land Learning College in Australia and carries a heavy burden. He must participate in or make decisions regarding many matters, and everyone respects his views and opinions. Such talent is needed. Whether it is a college, a society, or an institution, we need such people to unify the group and give everyone a clear direction so that they do not become scattered. However, in such a position, one must be careful, because your views and actions affect the masses—including the monastics, lay practitioners, and volunteers. You must have meditative concentration and maintain your right knowledge and right views; do not go astray.
In the past, I could offer you advice on these major directions and premises. Now, you must take responsibility yourself and avoid falling into your own subjectivity. As I just mentioned, unless you have realised your true nature, every thought and intention is nothing but sin and karma. In such a situation, you must constantly ask yourself and reflect. Sometimes, an inadvertent word or thought can affect many people. If the matter is trivial, it is fine; but if it affects the operation of the entire college, or even the opportunity for everyone to realise their true nature and be reborn in the Western Pure Land, you must be extremely cautious.
The Call to Action
Venerable Wuzhuang, you know Practitioner Su. You should understand her character and sincerity. If it were not for my prohibition, the current situation—where there is not even a greeting exchanged with our neighbours—would not have happened. I cannot blame you. The fact that Namo Amituofo abides at the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre is something I failed to lead you to see. That was my mistake. But now, I am using this opportunity to clarify and express this repeatedly. You must take this to heart. Because you have heard it, if you do not act upon it, you will have to bear the karmic consequences. Do not cover your eyes and plug your ears, pretending you have not seen or heard anything. You must know that you are leading everyone toward the Western Pure Land. The heavy burden of the 'Sangha'—one of the Three Jewels—is not just for Wuzhuang to carry; every monastic must shoulder it. If you think that by plugging your ears and closing your eyes, you are keeping your mind pure, and you set aside what your teacher has said, thinking it is just idle gossip—if you do this, the one who suffers most is yourself. You lack wisdom. This matter is extremely important. Seeing everyone like this, I must speak sternly. I am not just speaking to Wuzhuang; I am speaking to Master Dao, to every monastic, and to Hu Nini. Hu, you have also contributed much, and I hope you can take this to heart.
I have never spoken so sternly to you before, because Wuzhuang is a good person. Although he often has his own views and opinions, he does it for the sake of everyone. He respects his teacher and listens to his teacher, so I will teach him more. At the same time, if my words are harsh, you must understand: as a teacher, I fear you will not take it in, so I speak sternly. Please forgive me, for everyone is a Buddha—only the age and the role differ, but the capacity for does not depend on age. Perhaps I have read more sutras, taught more Dharma, realised more principles, and handled more matters than you, so I can offer you some suggestions. This is what I should do.
The Red Light of Health
Alas, Wuzhuang, your body is showing red lights! I can see the attached spirits on you—on your head, face, chest, shoulders, back, and legs. You must be careful. You must invite these spirits to leave. Once they are invited out, you will feel much better; your body will not feel so heavy, and you will be less prone to aging and illness. I wrote to you before, but there was no response. To save you—and saving you is equivalent to saving many monastics, Dharma protectors, and followers of the Pure Land—I have no choice but to speak this way. If you could come here yourself, and I could speak to you privately, would that not be better? Why must it come to this? Just make a phone call, contact us, and come over. Don't you often come to Goombungee to handle matters? I know what you are handling. These matters are necessary for spreading the Dharma in the world, to achieve the greatest benefit for sentient beings within a limited time, whether it is the formation of a group or the use of land. If there is an opportunity to benefit more people, what could be more important for the Pure Land than rebirth in the Western Pure Land? If you have the chance to utilise these resources, you should seize it.
Land left idle is just idle; it cannot exert its effectiveness. It is merely offering to the beings of the earth—the growth of plants and trees, or the ants and insects. When it is not needed, we do not touch it, but when it is needed, we must not be stingy with the Dharma. This land was also provided by others, who hoped it would be put to the best possible use. For monastics, receiving offerings from Dharma protectors and followers seems natural, but one must be very cautious. These offerings must be used where they are needed. If you leave them idle, or fail to use them when they should be used, you will have to bear the karmic consequences. When I was still there, we could look at these things together. Now that I am gone, you must discern clearly.
The Priority of Rebirth
What is more important than Namo Amituofo coming to the human world to save sentient beings? What is more urgent than helping beings be reborn in the Western Pure Land? Whether it is the Dharma Jewels or the existing resources of the college, including the residency of personnel, if you can help the other party achieve the greatest effectiveness in spreading the Dharma, you should do it. I have pointed out a major direction and a major goal. Ideally, I would have told you this privately when you came to visit. Now that it has come to this, I have to use this method to tell you. I do not know if you will hear it, but I hope you do. You are not hearing it; you are reading it. My message must be transcribed by a monastic into text for you to see. That is one thing.
Furthermore, regarding your own health: every word I say now is not just for one person, but for all disciples and monastics. Especially for monastics, life is limited. I am ninety-six, and I must go. Everyone’s lifespan in the human world is different. If you have the chance to encounter Namo Amituofo, you must seize it. I, Chin Kung, did not have enough ; I blocked my own future path. So, when I had the chance to find Namo Amituofo, I did not go. I have mentioned this many times here, and no one has responded, so I have to keep mentioning it. If someone responds, it means my words have taken effect and have been acknowledged. You should be clear about your own health condition.
Collective Karma and the Pandemic
The affairs of the college have been affected by the pandemic. I know this. After all, group gatherings are no longer suitable, and it was previously treated as a national prohibition, so fewer people have been visiting the college. This is inevitable; it is the collective karma of everyone. Under collective karma, one must be even more cautious, because individual karma involves many situations. This pandemic is a collective karma that takes lives; everyone must handle it with extreme care. Collective karma and individual karma involve past lives; often, one can only endure it. But if one has realised their true nature, they have already transformed their karma and are no longer bound by it. The pandemic does not discriminate; it does not only target the sick. Many healthy people have also had their lives taken. Because this karma was created in past lives, and you do not know what you did, you must educate everyone to face it with a positive mindset. You must not complain while taking precautions. You are leading the college forward; your own concepts and views must be correct, otherwise, you will be the first to suffer. Many spirits in the spiritual realms have karmic affinities with the college and are constantly observing the thoughts and virtues of every monastic, lay practitioner, and volunteer. Those with sufficient virtue will be respected, and sometimes even protected; those with insufficient virtue will suffer, and ghost deities will attach themselves to them.
The Danger of Thought
In fact, it appears that all the disciples have attached spirits. Looking at Wuzhuang’s situation, especially in the head—Wuzhuang, your thinking needs to be purified. You are too busy, thinking too much, hoping the college can be better and exert its greatest function. Now that some courses have been stopped, whether to gradually resume them is something Wuzhuang must take responsibility for, and it all requires the use of the brain. Now that I am in the Western Dharma-Nature Land, I have learned one thing: thinking attracts spirits. I see it very clearly, because I can see that when a human body has thoughts, spirits—pop—they enter. It is terrifying! I could not see this before, but now that I see it, I am afraid. If you do not have the ability, you really must not think. Why did I say earlier that 'every thought and intention of the beings in this world is nothing but sin and karma'? It is not just me saying it; this is mentioned in the Ksitigarbha Sutra. Because most people are selfish—when they think about something, as long as there is selfishness, thinking about the impact on themselves, the moment that thought arises, attached spirits enter. The more spirits that attach, the heavier your body becomes. This is true for everyone, not just one person. If the spirits are in the head, you will feel heaviness, fatigue, or an inability to concentrate. You may not be able to focus for long, and sometimes you may have a bloated or painful head. Be careful, and quickly recite the Buddha’s name.
Purification is Paramount
The most important thing in the Pure Land school is purification. If one has realised their true nature, they can be busy, busy, busy for the sake of sentient beings, but they do not have a single selfish thought, so spirits will not attach. If even a tiny bit of selfishness arises, they will attach. Do you have this problem inadvertently? You must examine, examine, and examine yourself! Stop for a moment. Living such a busy life from morning till night shows you are doing your best for the college, but in the midst of this, does it help your own rebirth in the Western Pure Land? This must be thought of first. The most urgent task is to do what helps your rebirth and your body-mind-spirit. You must pave the way for yourself and for the monastics, lay practitioners, and volunteers in the college. This is also necessary. Just as I, Chin Kung, had this place in Australia—the college land—and later built some houses, one must be self-reliant. Paving the way for everyone is what I, as the head of the family, should do.
However, looking at your current situation, if there is something more important to do, you must set aside what is in your hands. Your body, as I said, is showing a red light. Diseases of the internal organs do not change overnight. When symptoms appear, the spirits inside have actually been accumulating for a long time. To be clearer, when symptoms appear, many spirits have already gathered inside. If healthy cells can function naturally, they will not get sick. This is the reason for not aging and not getting sick that I mentioned before. Those who have realised their true nature do not age or get sick. So, if you are sick, uncomfortable, sore, or have chest tightness, or even if your eyesight has worsened, these are all symptoms of aging, and you will know whether you have realised your true nature. This is very plain language, perhaps a bit biased, but quite practical. If those who have realised their true nature are uncomfortable, it is because they are bearing the suffering of sentient beings, because the cells of those who have realised their true nature are stable and unmoved. They remain in a clean, pure, and good state. How could they get sick or age under such conditions? Even if cells undergo metabolism, it operates normally; there will be no deterioration, no evil, no illness, and no cancer.
The Reality of Spirits
Cancer is something no one dares to say will not happen to them. Among the people we know, some have passed away due to cancer. If you think your practice is still insufficient, you must be more diligent. must be constantly purified. In this Five Turbidities and Evil World, spirits can enter the body at any time, even demon crowds. Demon crowds are also a type of attached spirit. The body has inner demons and external demons. When I teach the Dharma, I do not exclude monastics. You also have the chance to be attached by demon crowds. Some demon crowds specifically look for monastics; as long as you violate the or appear selfish, they will attach, changing your mind and causing you to create negative karma. After all, as a monastic, you know your responsibility is to sentient beings and to spreading the Dharma, and you know how to do it. But if you have selfish thoughts, hellish suffering is inevitable. This is why it is said that 'the gates of hell are crowded with monastics.'
Sometimes you are easily fatigued. Be careful; your blood and liver problems—even with a physical examination, you can only find local problems. Many internal problems cannot be seen, especially the spiritual part, which will not be detected. But now I have discovered that many problems are triggered by spiritual beings—, attached spirits, and demon crowds. If Namo Amituofo and Practitioner Su had not opened their eyes to point this out, I do not think anyone would have the chance to discover it, nor would they be willing to admit it.
The Courage of Practitioner Su
Fortunately, Practitioner Su has risen. She has overcome all difficulties, without fear. Under the guidance of Namo Amituofo and Teacher Xia Lianju, she discovered the various things that everyone usually cannot see or notice. These spiritual changes and the affairs of spiritual beings are closely related to one's own body-mind-spirit condition and are a major obstacle to rebirth in the Western Pure Land. She was not afraid and spoke out bravely. This is also the reason why everyone excludes her and cannot accept her. But now, as I see it, it is the truth. I have seen it, which is why I admire her. Only those who have realised their true nature have the boldness to do such things. Most people would probably think that if they said these things, the overwhelming criticism would be unbearable, so they would cover up the truth, which creates very heavy karma.
So, Wuzhuang, the college is right next to the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre, maybe half an hour away. This is a magnificent Dharma affinity. I hope you will seize it. Namo Amituofo is not just in the Western Pure Land of Ultimate Bliss, ten trillion Buddha-lands away. Of course, when everyone sincerely recites the Buddha’s name, Namo Amituofo will definitely be in your heart. It is that Buddha-nature within everyone’s heart—the same Buddha-nature as Namo Amituofo. Everyone must recite the Buddha’s name well. If you recite the Buddha’s name diligently, but your heart is not in sync with the vows of Namo Amituofo, or if the things you do or the vows you make are distant from Namo Amituofo, then the chance to find the Buddha-nature within your heart is limited.
And now, I, Chin Kung, have truly seen that Namo Amituofo is at the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre, abiding in the temple, with Buddha-light shining upon everyone. Because Practitioner Su’s Buddha-heart, Buddha-vows, and Buddha-actions are in sync with Namo Amituofo, many things are done through Practitioner Su, because she has a body, which makes it easier to work and save sentient beings. Just like me—now I only have my spirit, and this power is too weak. When I speak, no monastic or volunteer responds. Does this not show that my spiritual power is too weak? One must have a body to get things done!
A Final Plea
Wuzhuang! Life is limited. Coming here can help you treat your illness. Do not say you have no illness; even your physical strength is not what it used to be. Here, you can invite spirits; you can invite the attached spirits and even karmic creditors out of your body and send them to the Western Pure Land. This is also ! In the past, I did not have the ability to help everyone invite spirits. Now, there is a method to make spirits and karmic creditors willing to leave your body, so that your burden is not so heavy, and you can cure your illness. But you must make them willing to leave. That requires virtue, the power of merit, and majestic power. Only then will karmic creditors or attached spirits be willing to leave automatically. Come here; the Buddha-light shines everywhere. The Buddha will definitely compassionately bless everyone, because your heart is willing to step in here, and the Buddha is also very happy. I say this, and perhaps you will ask: 'Teacher, you say this, does it mean our college does not have Namo Amituofo? Does it not have Buddha-light?' You cannot say it that way. The college has also done many good things, working hard for the Pure Land, taking care of everyone, circulating Dharma Jewels, arranging courses, and participating. It has even taken on some responsibility for the ethical education of Chinese people in Australia. This is very good, very good. Continue to do it; this is what we can do. The Buddha will definitely be happy and praise it, and the Dragon and Heaven Dharma Protectors will also help watch over it.
But if there is a better and brighter place, we should also draw near to it. Just as when I was alive, if you had any matters, you would come to find me, listen to my opinions and views, and then you would go and do it. Now that Namo Amituofo has descended and is at the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre, of course, for such a major matter as rebirth in the Western Pure Land, you must find the Buddha to have certainty. This is very natural. Do not stay far away; you will suffer a loss. Come find the Buddha and ask the Buddha to help purify your body. There are too many attached spirits, and even demon crowds have come to your door. Demon crowds are everywhere. Do not think, 'Ah? Teacher, you say I have demon crowds on me? Oh, how could I have demon crowds!' In fact, demon crowds are not only in our hearts, but also in our bones, muscles, and blood. This is not about who has them and who does not; in fact, many people have them. It is just that you cannot see them, and no one has pointed them out to you. Now, I, Chin Kung, have said it.
Now, let me tell you something even more shocking: when I was alive, I also had demon crowds on me! Because my thoughts were biased, I shielded everyone. I shielded the monastics, lay practitioners, and volunteers of the college and society, and I excluded Practitioner Su from our system. This bias, this selfishness, was a huge mistake, and the demon crowds entered. The demon crowds knew I was wrong, so of course they entered my body. Such a good opportunity, how could they give it up? Before, they had no chance to enter, but now that I made a mistake and spoke wrongly, they seized the opportunity and quickly entered. At that time, my body aged rapidly, and everyone saw it. This is a fact! Even I was like this, so you say, if you have demon crowds, attached spirits, and karmic creditors in your internal organs, it is not surprising. Monastics are like this, and many lay practitioners and volunteers are also unavoidable. It is just that no one has pointed it out to you, and no one with 'opened eyes' has told you clearly. To be honest, knowing such things is not easy! How many people have lived their lives in a daze, and after they die, no one knows where they go or where they go to receive retribution? They think it is over, not knowing that there is a great deal of 'article' after death!
Now, because Namo Amituofo has descended and Practitioner Su has told everyone these things, these shocking inside stories have been revealed. I hope everyone will not continue to make mistakes, and I hope everyone can quickly come to the temple. Purification is the fastest way to find your true nature and be reborn in the Western Pure Land.
I also hope everyone can be diligent and strive to find your true nature early, and actively cultivate talent, but you always need Dharma affinity. Practitioner Su’s ability alone is limited. She is busy from morning till night, and I, Chin Kung, really cannot bear to see it. Our Australian Pure Land Learning College has such rich resources. Sometimes I think, if we could support this place a little, and everyone could support and apply resources and abilities to each other, how good that would be! This is for the inheritance of the Buddha’s Pure Land, and for the sake of the immeasurable and boundless suffering beings to be relieved of suffering and be reborn in the Western Pure Land. You yourself are also one of these beings. It is not for Practitioner Su alone; everyone must be clear about this! Make a wise choice and come quickly! Saving yourself is saving everyone!
Alright, I have said enough for today. That is all.
Namo Amituofo.
Shi Chin Kung, with palms pressed together.
At the Western Dharma-Nature Land of the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre, Australia."
