Letting Go of Attachments: An Interview with Venerable Master Chin Kung

This is a record of an interview with the spirit of Venerable Master Chin Kung, who now resides in the Western Dharma-Nature Land of the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre in Australia. This account captures his reflections on his life's work, his transition to the Western Pure Land, and his earnest advice to his followers. Recorded by the chief writer, Venerable HaiZe, on October 12, 2022.

Venerable Master Chin Kung speaks:

"Namo Amituofo. Today, Namo Amituofo has given me a topic: 'No Attachments.' These three simple words encapsulate the deepest heart-matters of all sentient beings in this world. The heart is a crucial player in our existence, but when it comes to the critical juncture of spiritual practice, it becomes a troublesome companion. You know clearly that you should not be attached, yet you find yourself unable to control this heart of yours. If you could truly control it, these three words would not even need to be spoken.

If someone tells you, 'Just do not be attached,' and you reply, 'Ah, fine! I will let go and be at peace,' if you could truly achieve that, the world would be at total peace. If you still find yourself troubled, it is simply a case of 'the world is inherently peaceful, but the foolish person disturbs it.' This phrase exists because we often cling to things that require no attachment, trapping ourselves in misery and restlessness. Who suffers as a result of this attachment? It is you, yourself. To speak more subtly, when there is attachment in the heart, there is fluctuation, there is thinking, and there is the arising of thoughts. By now, all of you who have been studying should understand one thing: the moment a thought arises, that vibration spreads into the space around you. Even if you do not speak, even if it is just a thought in your mind, the space is already disturbed. No matter how minute or subtle the thought, it creates a ripple. In such a state, you have already lost your meditative concentration. True concentration is without ripples. Looking at the Three Learnings of Precepts, Concentration, and Wisdom, once you lose concentration, wisdom cannot easily manifest. Wisdom is inherent; it is only obstructed. Concentration is also inherent; it is only disturbed. In your true nature, there is no movement. Therefore, you must realise that these disturbances are external. Do not be attached. Any fluctuation is a form of pollution."

The Reality of Our World

"Someone might ask, 'Venerable Master, you say fluctuation is pollution, but who among us does not fluctuate? Does that mean we are all polluted?' Who does not fluctuate? Indeed, everyone fluctuates. Are we living in a world of polluted vibrations? Yes, that is exactly the case! So, where has our concentration gone? Modern people lack the power of concentration; they are easily swayed by external circumstances, easily troubled, and unable to master their own minds. Does this not all stem from this inability to settle down? Some might say, 'Venerable Master, you cannot say that one bad apple spoils the whole bunch, can you?' That is true, you cannot say that. But by saying that, have you not created a fluctuation yourself? Are you not also a part of this situation? Next time, observe carefully. See how many people are sitting there in silence, perhaps smiling, or perhaps not even smiling, just sitting there without any movement. Look closely, and you will see that some people truly have no fluctuations at all.

This is what we call 'attainment.' One can sit in the midst of stability, smiling as they observe everything. This smile is not one of mockery—do not misunderstand. A person who has truly attained such concentration and purity would never mock others. There are no thoughts for you to grasp onto; there is only a natural, gentle smile. They are already in this state, while your own heart is rising and falling, observing, creating thoughts, and making all sorts of interpretations. No matter how you interpret it, no matter what your thoughts are, the other person remains unmoved. They are the same regardless of what you say. This is what is called 'attainment.' While the other person does not say a word and does not create a single thought, how many thoughts have you created? You have troubled yourself and created so many afflictions."

The Test of Practice

"This is where you can tell whether someone has truly practised or not. If we look at it this way, there is a vast distance between the state of 'no attachments' and the state of being 'unmoved.' It is the compassion of Namo Amituofo that sees the heart-matters of everyone and asks us to reflect—including myself, Chin Kung, who must also reflect.

What each person is attached to may differ. On the path of practice, attachment is a massive obstacle. However, before you have realised your true nature, while you are still in a body governed by karma, if someone tells you not to be attached, you will still be attached. This is the nature of samsara; it is the entanglement of karma. Karma is like a fierce beast; it is not easily subdued. Without attainment, you cannot suppress it. Practice is not about doing whatever you want. This is a fact, clearly laid out before us. A person with wisdom can see at a glance whether you are attached to something. For example, parents who practise may be attached to their children or their family. Perhaps they do not think about it for a few days, but suddenly it pops up again, and they worry about their sons or daughters.

Those with awareness will quickly stop these thoughts. Those with insufficient awareness will continue to dwell on them. This is the best time for karmic creditors, attached spirits, and even beings from the demon realms to take advantage of you. This is a test manifesting before you. If you can stop it in time and not continue the thought, then congratulations! Although you cannot fully suppress it, at least you can cut off the thought in time—that is good. If you wait until the karmic creditors come knocking, whether it manifests as physical or mental problems, you will have to spend a great deal of time and energy on physical and mental adjustments. Inviting spirits and performing Chao Du will then be unavoidable. At that point, the beings are suffering, and you are suffering too! The best method is to discover your problems early and stop them in time. Do not let thoughts, attachments, longing, and the inability to let go continue to develop."

The Path of Letting Go

"Many people who practise may be attached to their parents, or perhaps former friends, lovers, or partners. When it comes to letting go, those with sharp roots of wisdom let go instantly. This kind of root is truly the capacity for learning Buddhism. These things were meant to be let go of; they were never truly there to begin with. It is only because of the laws of karma and cause and effect that there is any connection. Someone might say, 'Venerable Master, isn't it too heartless to practise Buddhism like this? You let go and feel at ease, but the other person suffers.' This is a case of 'if I had known today would be like this, I would not have acted as I did in the past.' But it is precisely because you did not know about today that you had the past. Worldly affairs progress in this way—complex, tangled, and difficult to resolve. No matter how you turn, you cannot escape the cycle of rebirth. Yes, they suffer, but 'long-term pain is worse than short-term pain.' If there were no such pain, there would be no opportunity for both parties to be saved later! In the practice of the Buddha's teachings, unless you are truly alone with no relatives and no attachments, you must practise diligently. This is not easy. As long as there is even a single thread you cannot let go of, it is a problem. The 'long-term pain is worse than short-term pain' I mentioned is the fastest method. People generally do not want to suffer too much; they will recover and stand up as soon as possible.

If you truly want to help yourself, help everyone, help sentient beings, and help the other party—those who have been kind to you, those you have lived with, whether they are parents, children, relatives, elders, or superiors—then you must practise diligently. You must gain attainment; you must acquire the power of concentration. This is the most basic skill you need to face sentient beings. You must have concentration. Once you have concentration, you will not be moved by the other party. You will know what you are doing, how to do it, and how to face sentient beings. Any joy, anger, sorrow, or happiness of sentient beings, or any of their words or actions, will not cause you to fluctuate. Only when you have this attainment do you have the chance to calm the other party down. Only then is it possible for them to accept your changes, and only then do you have the chance to influence them. If you are swayed by the other party and cannot stand firm, how can you talk about helping or saving them? Instead, you will drag yourself into the water with them. If your previous practice was so fragile that you were merely marking time, that might be one thing, but if you regress, that is a pity. However, this is also a test. There must be circumstances that manifest to examine how diligent you are in your daily practice. If you have faults, correct them; if you have progress, then good, continue to move forward. In short, on the path before realising your true nature, these are all things you must face."

The Advantage of Hsiang Kuang

"The advantage of the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre is that Namo Amituofo is here, Teacher Practitioner Xia Lianju is here, and Practitioner Su is here. When you tell them your problems and respectfully ask for their guidance, they will certainly help you. They will even point out the problems you cannot see yourself. From the perspective of practice, this already gives you a huge advantage. Elsewhere, you might listen to a master's teachings and then have to face your problems alone, or ask the master how to handle them. If the master is an awakened being, that is good; they can be of great help. If they are not awakened and have not been fully purified, even if your Dharma affinity is good, they might give you advice that helps, but sometimes it is not certain. They might say something, you might do it, but the problem remains. These situations can happen with masters, lay practitioners, and volunteers alike. For a master, it is even more important to face this problem seriously, because the role of a master is one of the Three Jewels—the Buddha, the Teachings, and the Sangha Community. The Sangha refers to the monks and nuns who bear the responsibility of transmitting the Buddha's teachings, helping sentient beings resolve their doubts, and passing down the methods of Pure Land practice. This allows every sentient being who chants the Buddha's name to see through and let go while they are still alive, so that at the time of death, they can truly be without attachments and follow the Buddha into the Western Pure Land.

Often, because the problems of karmic creditors and attached spirits are ignored, rebirth in the Western Pure Land is obstructed. Unless, as we have now, Practitioner Su is practising and has realised her true nature in the human world, and can freely travel to and from the Western Pure Land with her Dharma Body to lead spirits to chant the Buddha's name and enter the Western Pure Land, this is an event that is 'difficult to encounter in millions of years.' It is not easy to meet such a person; it is extremely difficult. This is a tremendous blessing for sentient beings—truly a tremendous blessing! Therefore, the cooperation between Namo Amituofo and Practitioner Su, under the watchful care of Teacher Practitioner Xia Lianju, is a perfect combination. This is the insight I, Chin Kung, have gained from what I have seen and heard during my time in the Western Dharma-Nature Land of the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre. If not for this opportunity to see all of this here, I would not have dared to believe such a good thing existed. How could such a good thing be right before my eyes? If you instead become suspicious, disbelieving, or slander it, you will suffer a great loss. The Buddha's teachings often involve inconceivable events, and one is happening right now. You must seize this opportunity! Good things and lucky things are often fleeting; it would be a great pity to miss them. Because people's blessings are insufficient, sentient beings' blessings are insufficient, they cannot retain the Buddha, and then everyone cannot return to the Western Pure Land and must suffer. If the blessings are sufficient, there is a chance to enter the Western Pure Land and a chance to realise one's true nature and attain Buddhahood! Therefore, this 'No Attachments' also encapsulates a reason why practitioners find it difficult to progress and difficult to attain concentration. The Buddha's teachings are just that subtle and that profound."

The Necessity of Self-Reflection

"Perhaps you feel, 'I am not thinking about anything, I have let go, I have no attachments to these things, and I know I should not do this.' But if you cannot control yourself and you do it anyway, are you not suffering a great loss? Sometimes you do not even recognise yourself; you do not understand yourself well enough. In this space, are your thoughts and actions sincere? Are the words you speak just to get by? Or are you deceiving yourself and deceiving sentient beings? Everyone sees it clearly, and those with discerning eyes see it even more clearly. Life is limited; there is truly not much time for you to slowly make choices or changes.

We can see that the fourfold assembly of disciples at the Buddhist Centre are all very busy. Being busy at the Buddhist Centre is a good thing; you can work for the masses and for sentient beings, forgetting your own afflictions. That is why Practitioner Su is always reminding everyone: keep doing, keep doing, do not let yourself have any gaps. Besides resting at night, now it is added that one day is used as two. This method is quite good; everyone should use it well. Actually, doing this is to allow everyone to practise wholeheartedly and not be attached to worldly affairs. Your relatives and friends may have been the focus of your life in the past, but now you must know that each person's practice is their own. You must know that if these things continue, you cannot escape birth, aging, sickness, and death, you cannot escape the entanglement of karma, you cannot escape the cycle of rebirth, and you cannot reach the Western Pure Land. It is for these reasons—any one of these reasons—that you should be prompted to practise sincerely. If you have found this path of practice and have already stepped onto it, then by all means, do not give up! Seize it firmly!"

The Importance of Renunciation

"Becoming a monastic is a very important matter. To truly find one's true nature and see one's original face, it is too difficult to do so without practice and without becoming a monastic! Through practice, if it can help you realise your true nature and attain Buddhahood, then this lifetime has not been in vain. The Buddha is compassionate. When I, Chin Kung, first heard this topic, I felt it was very natural and that I had no attachments. But now, I feel it has brought out my own true problems. Saying 'no attachments' is truly not easy. Whenever I mention the Pure Land societies or the Pure Land Learning College, my heart feels different. Although I have already left the world, my spirit is still here. As long as the spirit is here, it means Chin Kung is here. What left the world was this body; my heart and spirit are no longer bound by the body. I always hope that the Pure Land societies, the Pure Land Learning College, and the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre can cooperate. We are one body, working together for the Pure Land. This is a very good thing. Each has its own resources, complementing each other. The greatest beneficiaries are sentient beings. Helping sentient beings and benefiting sentient beings—is this not the purpose of our renunciation? Sentient beings who receive benefits are always joyful. Among my lectures, the lay practitioners and volunteers who truly listen and accept them make up the majority. I, Chin Kung, understand this, so the content I speak is always profound yet easy to understand. For the deeper parts or those that are not easy to understand, or those that need guidance, I will explain them one by one, according to your role and your Dharma affinity, using the most convenient and acceptable way to help you understand. The method I am currently using is to express the things I want to do or the things I want to contribute to while I am being interviewed here.

The Pure Land system, including the Hong Kong Buddha Education Foundation, has been a nearby place for me to spread the Dharma in recent years. Naturally, the followers, lay practitioners, and volunteers have had more opportunities to be close to me, and they are also influential. I, Chin Kung, very much hope that the content of these interviews during my time in the Western Dharma-Nature Land can be seen by the Hong Kong Buddha Education Foundation, or the Pure Land societies, or the Australian Pure Land Learning College, and that they can believe these texts are true and not false. This is not for my personal sake, but through my appeal, I ask everyone to come close to Namo Amituofo. I ask everyone to let go of the attachments I gave you in the past—that is... the decision to exclude Practitioner Su from the Pure Land system. This was a wrong decision. I hope that now that I am no longer in the human world, everyone can remove it. Do not be attached! Most importantly, for yourself and for the sentient beings connected to you, I hope the masters, lay practitioners, and volunteers in the societies and colleges can come close to Namo Amituofo and learn. No matter what, it will be helpful for everyone's rebirth in the Western Pure Land of Ultimate Bliss. At the very least, I am still your elder, watching over some things, and when I see them, I tell you. As for whether you believe it, and whether you have the awareness to believe it, that depends on your own destiny."

Learning from the Past

"I am still the same old master, and yet I am not the same old master. I say I am the old master because many people are still stuck on how I appeared when I was in the world, or what they learned—to listen and chant the Buddha's name. That is very good! At least those who listen have some foundation of attainment! But now I see that no one is listening to what I am saying, or there is no response even if they do listen, so I need to say it again. Because my previous teaching methods were insufficient, the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre can help fill those gaps, making it easier to be reborn in the Western Pure Land. I cannot be stingy with the Dharma, because I was stingy before, and I did not tell everyone what I knew about Namo Amituofo at the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre, and I tasted the bitterness of that. Now, having another chance, I will certainly seize it to tell everyone, so that you can be vigilant and not follow in my footsteps.

My footsteps have had a deep and wide influence. If an individual is affected, that is an individual's problem, but for the individual, this is a very important matter. Rebirth in the Western Pure Land is too important; it is not like playing house. Is there a chance for you to try again, a second time, a third time? Is there a chance to come back again? Life is only this once, and the moment of death is only that one instant. If you do not grasp it, you lose the opportunity, and what follows is having to reincarnate in the next life and continue to struggle. That is truly too hard; it is not worth it! For the masters, lay practitioners, and volunteers who are willing to come to the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre, Practitioner Su has also mentioned that he hopes everyone can come in and work together for the Pure Land, especially since Namo Amituofo can help everyone heal. This is not a fairy tale; this is real. As long as you are willing to take that step and enter the Buddhist Centre, everything still has a chance.

For those who have stepped onto the path of practice, whether you are a monastic, a lay practitioner, or a volunteer, the environment of the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre has already excluded many interferences. The important thing is whether your own practice has progressed. Do not keep attached things in your heart; you must let go! Without letting go, you cannot progress! Seeing through and letting go is an inevitable process for purification and realising your true nature. If you cannot do this, it is almost certain that you will continue to be busy and be one of those who spend their lives in birth, aging, sickness, and death. At the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre, if you do not progress because of attachments, that would be a great pity!"

The Wisdom of Letting Go

"Practice makes perfect. Some people say, 'I have never left my parents, I have no attachments, and it is not easy to just let go and practise.' Alas, this opportunity is not something everyone has. You may want it but not be able to do it, and even if you can do it, you may not do it well. Now, Namo Amituofo has given me, Chin Kung, this opportunity to chat with everyone here and remind you. That is the compassion of Namo Amituofo! Seeing this problem in everyone's heart—whether it is stuck or not, it is always hanging there, or it suddenly pops up during walking meditation to disturb you, making you create a thought—this is all called attachment. You have not let go thoroughly enough. This also needs to be learned. If you cannot learn it, you will have to be like this, stuck here and unable to progress. If you can cut through the Gordian knot and truly do it, then you are the one who will benefit. No matter what, this must be done.

Furthermore, let us talk about this attachment. Besides the difficulty of letting go of emotions, some people are attached to tangible wealth, land, houses, or family businesses. These things also make people with worldly blessings unable to let go. Entering the Buddha's gate requires emptiness! Only with emptiness can you realise your true nature. But to let go of these things is truly not easy. You must know that these are also blessings you cultivated in the past, which is why you have the blessing to possess them in this life. But you must also see if you can truly possess them. If you possess them, you must see how you use them. Those who are clever and wise will let go if they can. It depends on how you let go. The Buddhist Centre needs construction; if you can give generously to help with the construction of the Buddhist Centre, then you have tremendous blessings! This Buddhist Centre was built by Practitioner Su with a sincere heart because Namo Amituofo descended into the human world. The sentient beings being led are not just people; they are immeasurable and boundless sentient beings of the Dharma Realm! Once you make such a vow, whether you contribute money or effort, every sentient being led has a part of your heart in it. Oh, this is incredible! Those with wisdom know what to do. If you do not have this affinity or this opportunity, then let these tangible assets be. In the end, they will be taken away; they do not belong to you because you cannot take them with you. Can you take worldly wealth with you? When this breath is gone, you cannot take anything. What you can take is the karma you have created. Or do you want to return to the Western Pure Land of Ultimate Bliss with a light, cool, free, and awakened spirit that has no karma? That depends on whether you truly have wisdom. When this matter is explained, it is not that difficult. If it is not explained, it hangs in your heart, and it is always a matter that prevents you from progressing.

Looking at it this way, Practitioner Su is truly a person of sharp roots, clever and wise. He says let go and lets go; he says leave and leaves. Afterwards? Looking back at this path, he is too clever, too wise! If there had not been the process of seeing through and letting go in the beginning, there would not be the situation today of realising the Dharma Body and saving so many sentient beings! These are the paths that true spiritual friends have walked, and only then did they attain their current achievements in practice. This is for everyone to use as a reference and to learn from. This is very important, and one must have blessings to encounter it.

Those without blessings grope in the dark and cannot walk out. They cannot see through, they cannot let go, and day after day passes. Life gradually moves toward the end, and what do they take with them? Nothing. They cannot take anything. Only this spirit, this spirit that carries every bit of what you did in this life, your merits and your faults, moves toward the next journey. You must not reincarnate again! If you have achieved something in this life and can return to the Western Pure Land of Ultimate Bliss with the Great Compassionate Father, Namo Amituofo, then this life has truly not been in vain. If you realise your true nature and use the Dharma Body to save sentient beings, then what you take with you is not just your own spirit returning to the West. Besides the many sentient beings you saved before—whether they were saved to the Western Pure Land or to the heavenly or human realms—there are still countless sentient beings waiting for you to return to the West and take them with you. Helping them is also helping yourself. That is truly worth the price of admission; this life has really not been in vain."

A Final Appeal

"No attachments—it truly must be no attachments. I, Chin Kung, am here, and although I have brought up the societies and the colleges, I must still tell myself: No attachments! Alas, will they come or not? If they listen and come, it counts as believing in me, Chin Kung, and having a heart of filial piety—a heart of filial piety to come and see me. Actually, the most important thing is that they themselves can receive help. For me, Chin Kung, this is a regret and a repentance in my heart. I hope to be able to make amends, but looking at it now, no one has come to see me. It is inevitable that I feel helpless and sad in my heart. After all, I have spoken so many times without getting a single response. At this moment, I feel like a failure. I will follow the conditions; I cannot force it. Saying these things now is too late; no one pays attention. The so-called person is no longer in the world and does not ask about worldly affairs; even if I say it, no one believes it.

You must be responsible for your own practice; it has always been this way. Perhaps I, Chin Kung, still cannot see through and let go of this matter. In fact, there is no need for me to worry at all. It is just because I did not do this perfectly while I was alive, and it can be considered a repentance to everyone, which is why I am using this opportunity to make such an appeal. Otherwise, the person is no longer in the world; who would believe what I say? If you believe it and do it, you will receive the benefits yourself. If you do not believe it and do not do it, no one says you are wrong. If you can do it and come to the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre to find Namo Amituofo, you will receive the benefits of the Dharma yourself. This can also be considered helping me, Chin Kung, reduce the regret of not having done it perfectly in the beginning. This is possible; this is not wrong. It should be said that this is the main reason why I, Chin Kung, am here to appeal to everyone.

How you do it depends on you. I cannot do anything now. I have said what I can say. What follows depends on each person's own destiny. It can also be considered that I have done right by everyone. I have explained many things clearly and plainly, and there is nothing to hold back. I have frankly placed myself before everyone. If you are clever and have wisdom, you should also frankly face your own problems, shortcomings, and deficiencies, and come here to make up for them, so that you have a chance to return to the West.

Alright, that is all for today.

Namo Amituofo.

Venerable Shi Chin Kung, with palms joined.

At the Western Dharma-Nature Land of the Hsiang Kuang Pure Land Buddhist Centre, Australia."