This is a record of an interview with the Primordial Demon Ha-Ya, who sought deliverance at the Hsiang Kuang Buddhist Centre in Australia. He now resides in the Western Land of Nature. This account reflects upon his existence spanning approximately ninety-seven trillion years. Recorded by the chief writer, Shi Fa, on August 14, 2024.
Ha-Ya speaks:
". I am Ha-Ya. When people on Earth look up at the night sky, they see the stars twinkling, but they have no idea that within those densely packed clusters of light, there are spirits dwelling inside. Every space is filled with spirits; Earth itself is layered with countless dimensions, all teeming with sentient beings. The Dharma Realm is the same—endless space, endless beings. Spirits are everywhere, wandering aimlessly, with nowhere to go.
Seeing so many spirits suffering, I used to feel absolutely nothing. I never imagined that there would be a compassionate Practitioner Su who would go out of his way to save them! This truly astonished me. In truth, I was once a wandering soul myself. But ever since I joined the Demon Realm and became a demon within the Dharma Realm, I forgot the bitterness of wandering. I was obsessed with the sprint, desperate to make myself stronger and stronger. I was so busy fighting and snatching that I completely buried the suffering deep within my own heart."
The Unimaginable Sight of Deliverance
"Later, I realised that it was not that I had truly forgotten; I had simply chosen not to remember. As a great demon, how could I acknowledge my own suffering? That would be too cowardly, unworthy of a great demon. So, I chose to ignore it, to not care, and over time, that pain became buried in the deepest recesses of my being. I never thought these spirits would have a day of salvation. To me, that was simply inconceivable. I had always existed in the dark spaces of the demon realms, and even when I travelled to other planets, they were always those with similar magnetic fields to my own. I had never seen spirits being saved. I could not imagine the circumstances under which it would happen, nor how they would be rescued. It was a concept that simply did not exist in my reality.
The appearance of Practitioner Su was, for me, a shock beyond all shocks. The first thing that stunned me was that Practitioner Su actually saved those spirits. I witnessed it with my own eyes—the scene was magnificent. At that time, I saw Practitioner Su utilise his countless manifestations, and in an incredibly short span of time, he rescued the endless masses of spirits before me. His manifestations could be multiplied infinitely—as many as the space required, as many as the number of sentient beings needed to be led out of those dark realms. Can you imagine that scene? It was an endless stream of Practitioner Su's manifestations appearing, and an endless stream of beings being led out of the darkness. I could not fathom how there could be so many spirits."
A Power Beyond the Demon Realm
"Having been in the Dharma Realm for so long, I had limited myself to my own narrow space, so I missed much of what was happening. My vision was narrow, and naturally, the number of spirits I encountered was relatively small. But there was another shock: Practitioner Su is not a demon from our Dharma Realm; he is a human being from Earth. I have travelled to many planets, and Earth is one of them. No matter how I search my memory, I cannot recall a Practitioner Su living there! The Earth I saw was from about fifty or sixty years ago. Based on Practitioner Su's current age, he would have been born by then, but he had not yet studied the Dharma, nor did he possess his . Perhaps my shallow demonic power simply dismissed him as an ordinary person, failing to see the treasures hidden within him.
I can only blame my own weak demonic power. If I had been stronger, perhaps I would have snatched Practitioner Su away long ago to be my useful assistant. The third thing that surprised me was that Practitioner Su did not just save the spirits in our Dharma Realm; even the demon crowds were targets for his deliverance. Practitioner Su has the ability to subdue demonic enemies; no matter how great a demon is, in his eyes, they are nothing. I saw with my own eyes how easily he subdued a great demon, and after he took that demon away, I never saw that being appear again. Practitioner Su's appearance brought many new highlights to my path of becoming a demon. I encountered things I had never seen before, one after another—it was truly inconceivable."
The Futility of Imitation
"I began to pay close attention to Practitioner Su. Every day, I waited to see when he would enter the Dharma Realm. I would hide on the sidelines to watch, secretly trying to learn Practitioner Su's skills. However, no matter how I watched or how I tried to learn, I simply could not master them. It was as if Practitioner Su's skills were impossible to learn. No matter how I imitated him, I lacked his ability, which left me feeling quite disappointed. When I saw Practitioner Su begin to destroy the demon palaces, I was terrified. He used his abilities to demolish those palaces one after another, and he did it effortlessly and with incredible speed. The scene was as easy as a child on Earth playing with building blocks and knocking them over. Yet, those palaces were built with great difficulty by old demons, ancient demons, or demon crowds. Each palace contained countless traps and demonic powers, but to Practitioner Su, they seemed like nothing.
He was too powerful. Who did Practitioner Su learn these skills from? I became curious about the teacher who instructed him. Later, I sent my demon children and grandchildren to investigate, and only then did I learn that Practitioner Su learned all these skills from Namo Amituofo. I knew that Namo Amituofo had a Western Land of Ultimate Bliss, but I had never seen what it looked like, and I had never intended to go there. To me, the Western Land of Ultimate Bliss held no attraction because I knew it was where the Buddha resided. How could I, a demon, like to go to a place where the Buddha lives? I preferred to stay where demons appeared."
A New Beginning in the Western Land of Dharma Nature
"However, this time, my perspective changed. Practitioner Su's ability to learn such skills from Namo Amituofo is invincible. I have never seen any old demon, ancient demon, or Demon King surpass Practitioner Su, which means his ability far exceeds ours. That is not even to mention Namo Amituofo, who taught him—he must be even more powerful, to a degree I cannot even imagine. I am a bit mad as a demon; once I decide to do something, I will do it regardless of the cost, even if it means abandoning everything I once held dear. I have seen something more meaningful and valuable, so letting go of what I learned in the past is a small price to pay. I can simply start over.
Therefore, after seeing Practitioner Su and learning of Namo Amituofo, I decided to secretly study the Buddha's teachings, with the goal of mastering the skills of Practitioner Su and Namo Amituofo. But could I succeed? When my mental note was merely to secretly steal these skills for my own use, I could never succeed. I did not understand this at the time, thinking that if I studied hard, I would have a chance. How could I have known it was impossible? Later, I decided to go to Earth to learn from Practitioner Su directly. I believed he would be happy to accept me as a disciple and teach me his skills. I brought one hundred and ten Earth-sized groups of demon children and grandchildren to Earth to learn with Practitioner Su. I also brought another six Earth-sized groups to spar with the fourfold assembly of disciples under Practitioner Su. To me, it was a perfect arrangement.
However, I never expected that when I arrived on Earth, it was already filled with demon crowds, and there was no opportunity for me to get close to Practitioner Su. I was pushed and shoved among the demon crowds, and in the end, they were defeated, and I was brought by Practitioner Su into the Western Land of Dharma Nature. This is for the best. I now have the opportunity to listen to the sutras and chant Namo Amituofo in the Western Land of Dharma Nature. Although I have not yet mastered the skills, I feel that I have grown significantly. Namo Amituofo."
